freecounterpoint: The Derb channels Pepe

Tuesday, July 18, 2006

The Derb channels Pepe

Les grands esprits se rencontrent, I guess. Me, I'm not convinced.

10 comments:

The Darkroom said...: you aren't convinced that AQs means are minuscule compared to those of the former threats ?
I am not sure there is much to debate here - Derbyshire is just stating facts.; 7/18/2006 1:17 AM
Arelcao Akleos said...: He states few facts , and he chooses to omit many facts. Not that he would leave things unstated just because to do otherwise would de-oomph a "telling blow" into more of a Liberace slap.
Example? Let us just take one small part of his oeuvre, as aperitif if you will. In his list of "Jihadi nations" why does he omit Iran? If ever a leadership was keen on being noted for its jihadiship it is that of the Qomists. And why does he omit nations whose military and political infrastructure are shot through with jihadists [sufficiently so to make impotent the elements who are not, and to make potent terrorists and war]? Example, Lebanon, where the standing government is little more than the gilding on the Hebzollahic Shit [as Bush finally spoke honestly on]. Or nations where the non-jihadists are not exactly "impotent", but are merely reeling on the brink of impotency? Examples, Pakistan and Indonesia?
And what about nations which are so confronted by jihadism that they face a harsh choice between civil war or steady appeasement and being coopted? Examples, Nigeria, Malaysia, Egypt.
And. natch, what about nations which play a double game of "doing business with Kufr" while leading and financing jihadi movements fucking everywhere The Uber Example, "Ever Our Friends and Allies" the Saudis.
That the Derb found it utile to limit the list of "jihadi nations" to the weakest three he could conjure up says volumes as to his unwillingness to think through what the West is facing. To be polite about it.
But in that torpor, that distaste for the unwavering eye, he is most definitely not the only peep.; 7/18/2006 5:19 AM
Tecumseh said...: The Derb has had an epiphany of sorts a few months ago, and now is vying for the coveted "Strange New Respect" moniker from the Beautiful Set. He's not gonna get it -- still too many flashes of lucidity interspread through his prose to fit inn there with Kos, Sheehan, Moore, and the gang. But, putting this together with Buckley's ruminations as of late, I think it's indicative of a certain drift at NR, at least. Getting wobbly, as Maggie once said?; 7/18/2006 7:55 AM
The Darkroom said...: aa - your statements are correct - there is no doubt that the jihadists are an enormous threat to the civil societyies that they infest.
But the point of the argument (and of the summer discussions I've had with ai) is that of the threat to western civ swhich i (and derb) find ridiculously exaggerated.; 7/18/2006 9:54 AM
Arelcao Akleos said...: So ridiculously exaggerated that the nations of the EU change themselves, their laws, their respect for free speech, their history, never mind their foreign policies, in order to fend off the day of reckoning with these merely "civil" points of difficulty.
By the way, do you think the consequences on Afghanistan and India, and not them alone,due to the Pakistani jihadists elements woven through that government and society are an example of such civil conflict? You think this has no consequence for us?
The Hebzollah/Iran action is internal to Iran?? Or even Lebanon?? So, then, why exactly this little war between HI and Israel? Why the funding of Sadr Militias and working with the Syrians to make Iraq safe for twelve good Imams and the saddamic Sunnistas?
Even in more muted Indonesia, do you think East Timor and Bali would agree with your judgement that we should consider their lopped off heads merely a civil action, somehow disconnected to the Ummahs religious impulse to jihad?
You think the Islamic movements in the Phillipinnes and Thailand and Burma are internal disputes? You think they lie when they join hands with the Jamaal Islamayat, in Jakarta and Kuala Lampur, and declare their actions as the first step of a south asian pan-islamic world?? All with the beaming face of a Saudi ambassador in the background?
You think the Islamic Jeyadeen aiding the Sudanese government, in stamping out what is left of the kufr in southern Sudan, is a group internal to Sudan?
But then Frenchman muttering of "choses ridiculeuses", while Vienna--metaphorically speaking-- fights for existence, is an old sad story.; 7/18/2006 3:49 PM
Arelcao Akleos said...: AI, the Buckley/Derb phenomenon is not so surprising, at least not to me......they are that kind of conservative, social-to-the-bone conservative, who find it personally distasteful to put religion and movements working within them on the same intellectual level playing field as we would put the various political isms. This is not a question of belief, I think, for although Buckley is a committed believer the Derb is a self professed agnostic. It seems more like an innate predisposition to "reverence", where the lack of it rubs them wrong in a way hard for them to rationally articulate.
However innate, or not, my disposition is the exact opposite.; 7/18/2006 4:28 PM
Tecumseh said...: I don't know enough to judge about teh Derb, but in Buckley's case, at least, I think this is partly due to the effects old age has on one's verve and pugnacity. Recall that he was not just blowing hot air when the Cold War was young, circa 1949-1950, but rather, he took a stint in the CIA, as befitted an aristocratic Yalie at the time. And the Cold War was rather hot then, involving real bullets and real risks if caught by NKVD goons (no head-hacking, just a bullet in the nape of the neck, in a Lubyanka basement). So I'll refrain from saying anything critical of buckley -- in my book, he paid the dues, fought the good fight for oh, 50 years or so, he can get a pass now in his twilight, and say pretty much anything he wants, methinks.

But Derbyshire, though, I don't recall him putting his neck on the line, and he's not that old, either, is he? So I'd keep his feet to the fire for what he says.; 7/18/2006 5:30 PM
Arelcao Akleos said...: I agree, AI. Buckley seems to now have that distant air of someone more in conversation with his God than with those of us still enmeshed in the fabric of life. Derb, I don't know but suspect, outside of the realm of mathematics and science, relies heavily on a "conservative instinct". That is, for him it is more a question of personality than thought through conviction. But I'm not sure he is important enough, as a commentator on these times, to warrant a thorough analysis. Life is short, and all that; 7/19/2006 1:40 AM
Tecumseh said...: Amen to that, AA -- I couldn't have said it better. It's satisfying to see, now and then (alas, not as often as one would like, but c'est la vie, I guess) a conversation going round and around for a while, and then converging to an agreement, which perhaps was not that clear before the conversation started. How come that doesn't happen more often in life?; 7/19/2006 1:24 PM
Anonymous said...: Well, according to Malcolm in the Middle, it may be because Life is Unfair AA; 7/20/2006 2:46 AM